Talmar Anderson from The Boss Action
Erin: Alright, well we are so happy to be here today with Thought Leader Magazine and, Chris Carr was on last week with somebody really fantastic and we’re so excited to bring you somebody else that is absolutely amazing. I met this individual just a few months ago and everything I’ve been learning about her; I am just wowed and the reason we have Thought Leader Magazine is because we’re wanting to bring together people who are disrupting their industry and people who are wanting to really set themselves apart from others.
And so, today we have somebody absolutely fantastic to bring on. Her name is Talmar Anderson. She is the founder of The Boss Action and she specializes in hiring strategies and is a boss best practices expert. So, Talmar, let’s get you on here today. How are you?
Talmar: I am great. Erin. Thank you so much for having me. I’m really excited to be here with you today.
Erin: Absolutely. Absolutely. We’re so happy to have you. I’d love to start off and just have you share with everyone a little bit about what inspired you to create The Boss Action and what’s behind the name and what really made you want to pursue this path?
Talmar: Well, I come from an operational background my whole life and I really I love telling people what to do. So, bossy has always been following me around, but that’s not actually why it’s called that. I’ve always led companies, led teams and I stepped out on my own in 2011 and I really was attracted to helping the entrepreneurs and the business owners. And so because I had such a breadth of experience and expertise, I kind of was oftentimes similar to a business coach and that I could, you know, talk about all the different facets, you know, accounting, management, marketing, IT, whatever it was, you know, running a business I could advise and that’s where I was getting a lot of my clients.
But I really noticed that one, the entrepreneurs were growing. I mean people were really like, I’m not just going to be a consultant. How do I turn this into a business that’s good for me, my family, my life, you know, gets me to scale and I saw that there was a real missing piece. And what I did is I went back, and I looked at a case study for seven years of my past clients and I found that no matter whether I work with a person for an hour consult or a full year program, everyone had questions on how to hire and build their own team and then how do I manage them? How do I motivate them? How do I engage them? How do I help them be as successful as they can be? And so, there’s really not a lot out there for the entrepreneurs that are growing.
Once you get to about, you know, I don’t know, a few, a million or two you’re usually in some kind of a mastermind program at that point and they will teach you hiring on some level as a part of a bigger program.
But for the business owner that really has their sales kicking and they just can’t get, they won’t get to that million or 2 million or 5 million mark if they don’t learn to bring the people around them. The only chance they had because they don’t have a lot of time and they did not have the expertise. The only thing they could do is go to a recruiter and recruiters are awesome when you’re tight on time, but they are so expensive for small business, right.
If you have to hire three people this year, whether it’s a receptionist or it’s one of your key members, you’re going to be paying at least 3,000 more likely, 20 to 25,000 per person and that is every time you hire, but there’s something to that recruiter expenses. You still as a business owner, need to be able to identify what you need in your business and if no one has ever given you the opportunity to walk through your organizational structure and really consider what the business needs and work, what I call that shift from business owner to boss with you, you’re really at a deficit and you can spend tons of money as a business owner trying to attract and build that kick-ass team that I want everybody to have because that’s the success differentiator.
So, I wanted to change paths. I wanted to give everybody a solution, a hiring solution. How do I learn to really truly bring people in for my company? Not any company. You know, Erin, if you and I had receptionists, we would need different people and so it’s really important that you as a business owner for your company know what is going to be successful for me. Not just we can’t have the same employment ad because we would never hire the same person and nobody’s really teaching everybody this. So, I was determined to build the resources and really get the word out that this is the key, the difference between a company that goes under and a company that grows to five, 10, $20 million or even just 500,000 if you just want a small business. If you want it to be successful, you have to have a team. It’s not a question, it’s a have to.
Erin: Got you. Even you notice today versus, you know, even 30 years ago, it’s not the same where people, you know, they got their job and they stayed there, you know, from day one until the day of their retirement. Now it’s, it’s almost it’s a two way street between organization and the employee of saying, okay, I’m going to, I’m going to work here, but if I’m, if I’m not happy, if I’m not satisfied, I’m going to go find something else.
Talmar: Absolutely, and it’s not even about not being satisfied. So, sorry, I could go into a lot more. I’m like are we talking about hiring or do you want to go to the – because
Erin: I will get questions about that.
Talmar: I probably would love to go into that, but I also don’t want to hijack your perspective for this interview, but I would say that 100% we need to be very mindful about the fact that the economies have shifted and people, the thing I teach people is don’t invest in gold watches.
You’re not going to hire once and if you’re once and done, that’s not what a successful business is. You are going to be there, you want the best person for the job right now and what that means is your company may not grow past that need, but for sure that employee is going to continue to grow and get betters so, of course they’re going to move on in two or three years.
If you’ve got a good strong engagement and they’ll stay that long then you’re onboarding them correctly and you hired correctly, two to three years is actually a good tenure now. But what that means is the business owners and the people that are running companies, even if it’s your vendors and independent contractors, even if it’s not direct employees, that’s your team and you have to get this skill set so that you can give them the tools they need, and they can build a success. That’s the real shift.
Erin: Got you. That’s it. No, and I love that. That’s great and so important to talk about.
Talmar: Yeah. Yeah.
Erin: Well, let’s kind of dive in a little bit. You know, one of the reasons we asked you to it to come on here with, with Thought Leaders is because we really see you as one and so when we originally talked, you know, what came to mind for you? What does a thought leader mean to you?
Talmar: Well, I think that thing that, at least from my perspective that a thought leader has, and not everybody has, is a willingness to say the uncomfortable thing, right. We’re willing to say what everybody’s thinking or worried about and make it a discussion point right. So, we’re going to say, no. You know, no, you know, no ketchup doesn’t go on a hamburger. Ketchup goes on a hot dog.
Now that’s a very unpopular thought process but I stand by it. Whatever the issue is, you have to be willing to put it out there and be willing to discuss it without a fence, without, you know, temperatures going out of whack. Whatever we’re talking about. The unpopular stuff is where we get uncomfortable and growth can really, really happen. So, somebody that can confidently step into that space and say, let’s talk about the hard stuff. Yes, boss, you’re the problem here. You’re creating your own chaos because you’re shorting your business by hiring the wrong people or whatever the issue is. Calling somebody out on that is not always comfortable, but it’s how they will get past where they’re stuck at today and that’s thought leadership is talking about that in my mind.
Erin: Got you. And would you say that when you go into organizations or you work with business owners that that’s part of your job is to, to say the unpopular uncomfortable thing to them?
Talmar: Yeah, and you know, unfortunately a lot of them are coming to me because they’ll find a repetitiveness in the underperformers they are hiring and so I help them identify what that is and certainly what I would tell you is within like a month, some the latest three months of the program, because it’s a four month program, if you’re working one on one with me – by that third month they’re like, it’s a total shift and they see it and they know it and they can go, oh yeah, I totally would have made that mistake.
When we start looking at who they’re hiring now and how it’s different, I’m like, you know, or the people they pass on more specifically. So, like, yeah, I love that guy. I would have totally hired him yep and we’d have fired him in three months. So, the fact that they get to see it themselves, but I’m more than happy to say, this is not going to change unless you’re willing to take the step and so that directness and the specific, it’s not a judgment. I don’t care if you do it or not. I don’t think you’re bad. You’re doing what the majority of us have been doing as our mistakes. It’s just about being willing to say it in a way that they can hear and not be too defensive.
Erin: Yeah. That’s good actually.
Talmar: That’s not that not thought-leader-y I think.
Talmar: Does that make sense?
Erin: Okay. So, then how would you, since you’re helping other business owners and people in leadership and other bosses, how would you describe your leadership style?
Talmar: Excellent question. Wow. So, okay. My leadership style is based on accountability, a hundred percent personal accountability. I structure my teams and my communications to always have a windup at the end and that wind up is laying out who is in charge of what piece so that at the end of the day, regardless of what happened, we know who to go back to for each piece right. I know what I did or didn’t do. I know what you did or didn’t do and what that does is personal accountability is not always about finding fault.
It’s also about being able to go, you just freaking kicked ass. I’m so excited for you. You just landed that project. You totally said you were going to take this thing, and this looks beautiful, this program, whatever the issue is, personal accountability allows for success as well. But 100%, my fundamental, it’s exactly, it’s in fact a boss action truth that I preach to all of my people. A boss provides the tools, the team builds success.
I can’t do anything if everybody hasn’t done their piece and what I have to do is do my piece and then go to them and say, what do you need for success? So, all of my leadership is built on communication, on setting up the expectation of what the team needs to deliver and making sure and fighting for whatever I have to do to make sure they’re protected, and they have what they need. That’s my job. It’s getting them what they need. Whether that’s time, tools, more team members, money, whatever it is that they need, my job is to take care of that.
Erin: Yeah, no, that’s awesome and I love how you, how you say that your job is to take care of them.
Talmar: Yeah and that’s the shift. That’s the shift for business owner to boss. When you start to move your business. I mean, again, it’s just a good example because my philosophies are what’s built around the business obviously, but if you can really stop thinking about all the pieces and really move the pieces to the people, then you’re free to give them what they need for success and people can be more specifically successful.
Erin: Yeah, I love that. Oh, that’s fantastic. So, then when you’re coaching people, you’re guiding people on, on how to hire, what would you suggest or that are the top five things that you should look for in a team member? And it may vary or maybe what you would look for in a team member?
Talmar: I was like the top five a hundred percent should be specific to the individual and the company and the position,. The company and the business owner do have some symmetry if you built your business model correctly. So, oftentimes the things you’re looking for are what makes a good team for you and your business and your industry. But for me, my change for Talmar and Boss Actions, positivity 100%. If you can’t see possibilities, it’s not a thing that I can work with well. Which is not to say we don’t consider risk, but that has nothing to do with possibilities because that’s, you know, planning for success, positivity.
That’s my first one. So, I had to write them down cause I was like, what would be my pick. Nonjudgmental. I do not go to my clients and go, boy, you’re really messed up dude. You are so lucky to have me. I’m not there to tell them, necessarily that it’s their fault. They know it, my people know, look, I’m creating my own chaos. I’m the one that needs to get my stuff together so that my company can be successful.
So, it’s not about judging, and I don’t look for my team to hold people on that kind of space, for better or worse we’re all the same and we’re all playing for the same reason. But then after that it’s expertise. So, the thing that I want people to realize is you need to hire for what you need right now and if I layer in lots of pieces of lots of things like kind of, I call it a unicorn, they have no chance for success. You know, if you look for a bookkeeping person who also makes beautiful graphics for social media, who also is great at customer service on the phone, that’s maybe you if you’re the entrepreneur.
But if you are honest, probably not all three of those are your best. Find the expertise and so when I hire for social media, I want social media expertise, not a marketing guru. I want that. If I’m hiring for branding, I hire for branding. If I’m hiring for phone, customer service then I’m hiring for that communication skill. So, recognizing expertise is the number third piece. It’s after positivity. It’s after nonjudgmental because those are part of my team culture. So, there’s expertise and then the fourth one, see I’m looking again strong communicator because in case you can’t tell, I use too many words in everything and I have to rely on my team doing that.
Erin: It’s better to over communicate than under communicate.
Talmar: But I also have very specific ways I like to communicate. I suggest that personal accountability. I’m not a you know, “does this feel okay? Do you think you’ll be alright?” I mean, I care about my humans and I’m like, what is going on? You’re obviously stressed out about something but I’m not, that’s not how I work on a day to day basis. Does that make sense?
Talmar: And some people will take advantage of that. So, I can’t take in those people that are going to be offended by that. I swear too much. So, I got to make sure that they are real cool with that and there’s communication style and communication skills. Two things, but it’s my number four and then my fifth and last thing is efficiency that I hire for. I personally have a belief that you need to constantly be progressing and what that means is, if I’m not moving to the result I need, I need to change my course. and so that gets shown in efficiency. So, I find people that can deliver their expertise in a very specific and purposeful way, which ends up in efficiency. So, that was a lot of words. Whew, I’m wordy today.
Erin: I mean that was fantastic. I mean a lot of those are so important and the way you have those five there, they’re applicable to really anybody because when you talk about expertise
Erin: Yes, that that’s an overall category that I may need this, or you might need that. and sometimes entrepreneurs or business owners, they get stuck in the, well, I might need this now, but in three years, this person, how are we going to have them adapt to that, but I love your philosophy of hire for what you need now.
Talmar: It’s for small business. Now once you have a medium sized business or a corporate culture, then you can look at succession, hiring. Hiring for people and creating great training and intern programs. I’m all for that. But a small business does not have the time, the resources, the money. It’s not in your best interest to be a teacher today. Be successful, be brilliant at what you do and that will give you the capacity of time and money to go back and build some kind of an effort to train or be community oriented or spend the time to mentor people up.
Erin: Yeah. Okay. I like it. I like it a lot.
Talmar: Everybody will say you know, hire and train them up but I, I disagree with that for a small business. I don’t think we have that time cycle, especially not in today’s economy.
Erin: Yeah, no, it’s a great perspective. One I guess I hadn’t thought of before. That’s really great.
Talmar: Thought leader.
Erin: So, from a different perspective, what’s a positive habit you have? You’re a business owner, you’re an entrepreneur. What’s a positive habit that you have that’s important to you?
Talmar: So, one is I don’t have time to be offended. That doesn’t necessarily mean that I don’t care what you think. I’m certainly going to absorb and hear what you say, but I just choose to believe that you’re not trying to be a horrible human. You might be trying to be a horrible human, but it only works if I take offense. So, I can’t tell you and there are certainly some things that would offend me, but I mean, people would really have to work at it and what I find is when I’m near somebody that could be that offensive, I go over there. So, I just remove myself from those situations. So, I take no offense.
Erin: That’s, that’s awesome.
Talmar: It’s liberating, there’s less stress. I don’t have to dwell… I don’t think, what did they mean behind it? So, again, another big concept for me is that I assume no malice. I’m going to assume that everybody speaking is trying to share their perspective. There’s intention, there’s understanding, there’s so many layers to how we communicate that people forget it all starts with ourselves. It’s how we listen. It’s how we apply our experiences, our perspective to the words we’re hearing and if we don’t allow the space that the speaker is coming from a different perspective and they literally can’t have the exact same experience as you, even if they went to the same schools, are in the same industry. There’s no way all words mean the same thing to the person speaking and to you because we are different humans. And so, if we can allow for that space, I think we can be a lot nicer, friendlier, and not spend the personal stress of being offended or overwhelmed.
Erin:Yeah. It reminds me of a book I read, I think in college called “The Four Agreements.”
Talmar: Oh yeah, yes.
Erin:Yeah. And one of them is don’t take things personally.
Talmar: Personal is hard but I disassociate from a lot of, you know, somebody is like, I was trying to think of something offensive I’d be willing to say on record and I am not because I’m not an offensive person,. But, you know, oh, that Talmar, she’s so dumb. Well, first of all, they obviously don’t know me because I don’t think many people think of me as dumb and, what I also know is the majority of people that are casting sounds as they’re talking to themselves and I’m like, oh, are you having a bad day? Which kind of pisses them off more and is a little fun for me. I admit it I’m not a good person all the time. I’m just a patient with others. So, yeah, I just don’t want to, it just doesn’t, it just it, not that I’ve never, but I really don’t take offense.
Erin: I’m going to wrap up here. I think my, my last question for you. Let’s get ready for the last one. What piece of advice would you give a new business owner or entrepreneur just starting out?
Talmar: It’s a huge question. I think that the lesson I continually hear from people that are finding success and that I would share as well, is you don’t have to figure it out. So, that’s one of the things I tell people. Business is not innate. No one was a born knowing how to build and run a business. It is all learned. So, business is not an innate, it’s learned so get help as soon and as often as you can. Find the shortcut, find the answer, stop doing the things that you don’t like. You don’t have to know everything.
In fact, I was just at a talk and one of the things she said was, you know, as a CEO you get to be the dumbest person in the room. If you’ve got the great team you get to say, so I have this idea for the company and they, and then you go, so how are we going to do that? And that’s what you want. You want to be surrounded by people that are brilliant at their pieces and are going to the same way with you so that you can just learn from them. What is the best way to communicate that message? What is the best way to motivate our team to do this? What is the best way to hire, in what succession or build the next product, diversify. and so, it’s about letting others help you by getting the help, the answers faster. Does that make sense? It was long.
Erin:Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. It’s so, it’s so important and, and you’re right, it’s a huge question and you know, because everybody has a different piece and if everybody can take those pieces and put them together, you know, we’re all going to help each other out.
Talmar: I’m sorry to interrupt. There’s so much content on the Internet right now. So, it can be overwhelming, and I get that. So, do align yourself with people that have philosophies that you like, but there’s no reason not to go out there and absorb some of the information- enough to learn how to hire the expert for your company. I don’t need to know all of the analytics behind social media. I need to know the companies that are doing well from people in my industry and I need to know the people that have been referred and then I have to go and check that out. But once I know that they’re the right people, I don’t have to learn anything more about it. I get to say; this is what we need. How do we get there? And they tell me what to do and I love that and it’s where my clients love. Just tell me the answer. We just want to know the answer. So, stop trying to figure it out, get help. That’s my point.
Erin: And go to Talmar.
Talmar: For hiring yes, for hiring and being a boss.
Erin:Love it. Well, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us today and just sharing all your wisdom. As I said before, I brought you on, you’re really disrupting the industry when it comes to hiring and helping bosses and I love your approach and I think that a lot of people could use your voice and your perspective. So, if anybody needs a little bit of help with hiring or, with strategies on best practices, you know, she’s going to be your person. So, Talmar thanks so much for being here today. We appreciate it.
Talmar: And Erin, thanks so much for spending the time and working this room with me.
Erin: Absolutely. Absolutely. Thanks, Talmar. Alright. Well, thank you guys for chiming in today and being here. We’re really excited to continue growing our thought leaders magazine and in being a part of, you know, people who are disrupting their industry. So, we look forward to seeing you again next week. Bye, bye now.